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Let's talk about Villager Trading! - Librarian, Wondering Trader

The latest snapshot/preview includes experimental changes to the wandering trader and librarian trades, which we're introducing to rebalance the villager trade system. Here's a look at what's changed: 

Librarian

Before these changes, players could get any village enchantment from any librarian. A novice librarian could sell the best enchantment in the game! For some players, this felt too random and made trading feel overpowered when compared to using the enchanting table or searching for enchanted books in structures.

With the new rules, librarians from different biomes sell different enchantments, and each village biome has one enchantment that is only sold by master librarians.

Players will have to work towards getting the best trades instead of relying on random chance. We hope this makes librarian trading more interesting and skilful, while also revealing some clues about their history of each village type through the enchantments that are sold there.
 
Wandering Trader

Some players felt that the Wandering Trader had unfair prices and didn't sell many useful items. We have lowered their prices, added more trades and increased the amounts available. The Wandering Trader will also now buy useful items from players, so it's possible to help them on their journey by giving them supplies even if you don't feel like buying anything.

As this is an experiment, we would really appreciate your feedback as work continues and to help us decide on the future direction for villager trades!

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  • 0
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    I don’t like the biomes specific trades, I think they should make librarian villagers have certain roles. Like an armor enchantment librarian or a tool enchantment librarian. Maybe the little book shelve in the lecture can function like a chiseled bookshelf and if you put an protection 4 book in it the librarian will focus on armor enchants. I also think efficiency and sharpness should still go to 4b but not 5. 5 is a little broken

  • 1
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    Having a mechanic to make books specific to villagers is a cool idea, but biomes is NOT the way to go. Too often will players be locked out by the fact that certain biomes are incredibly far away and impossible to find without commands/cheats.

  • 137
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    This has to be the worst idea since phantoms 

  • 0
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    Oh boy. I cannot wait to travel thousands of blocks just to get to my specified biome trading hall, just to make a trade, just like I can't wait for someone to make a mod to remove this change if it ever gets added.
    Please. Trading halls are already enough of a pain. Maybe and I mean MAYBE if there was a faster/more efficient way to transport villagers other than land boats and minecarts, and maybe if they kept their trades upon crossing the "biome border". This would make a trading hall still viable for SMPs and Multiplayer... Could do something with the Deep dark, maybe like a resonating bell, and villagers will follow you when you ring it, idk. 

  • 160
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    Making an already tedious mechanic even more tedious isn’t how you balance the game

  • 0
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    I really like most of the changes. I especially like the wandering trader upgrades, and I think you should go as far as you want with it, it might make them a little bit less of a nuisance. One thing I don’t really like is the changes to villager trading. And I like the biome specific trade part, but I don’t think that mending should be, mending which you can’t get from an enchanting table you could allow all the villagers to have a chance of having it, for instance, you could have in the expert level for the desert to be either efficiency three or mending with mending being a small chance of getting it I just think that it’s too good of an enchantment to make it biome specific. Just considering that the majority of players play with mending on a regular basis, and if I have to drag a villager all the way to the swamp and then level it up to get mending, considering how difficult it is to move villagers that just does not sound like a good feature. Other than that, it’s pretty cool, and I like the fact that you removed enchantments for fishing rods, etc. all and all it seems pretty good I just would really work at the more balanced trading part.

  • 2
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    Please don't change the villeger trading system it's fine as it is the other changes from the snapshot are cool.

     

  • 1
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    Players who have set world borders and are playing in limited worlds will find the game difficult with this change as there is no biome variation.

  • 0
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    Making the books biom-dependend isn't the way to go in my opinion, maybe just making Mending and the the other top tier enchantments only available for master vilagers randomly is good enough, and only getting top tier lvl 3 books is not much, lvl 4 would be optimal. Fixing the price reductions via zombies is good. The Anvil exp system should be reworked, it doesn't make much sense now and some prices just get rediciolus, especially a problem if one only gets lvl 3 books, and the exponential increase is a bit too much. The "To expensive" at lvl 39 is also annoying, should be at like lvl 50 or not even ther to begin with, one can choose when it gets to expensive oneself, gaining lvl is getting harder with higher lvls regardless.

  • 1
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    Rather than limiting the types of enchantments by biome, I would like villagers in any biome to sell enchanted books below a certain level.

  • 0
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    Great change. I love adding incentive to use the enchanting table over villagers. The enchanting table is basically useless at the moment, so adding more reasons to use it is great. And I think that these changes are a great way to do this. The only thing i can complain about is that there should at least be villages in the Jungle and Swamp. It seems like a little too much for players to figure out on their own, so making a village for those biomes, or even just giving the player a hint would be nice. Also make anvils more intuitive so combining books (like this update incentivizes) is not as weird as it is right now 

  • 1
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    I like the biome dependent trades, but I really don’t like the removal of max level trades, make the max level rarer, more expensive, and only at the higher level, I feel like this will make the change more digestible and accepted.

  • 88
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    I think that this will make people stop using the feature of the game because it will be nerfed to much. I think that instead of this they should increase the prices of the the more useful books like mending and unbreaking.

  • 0
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    I'm glad you're finally addressing the problem of OP Librarians, but I think there could be a more elegant solution. As some have already stated, it makes it flat-out impossible to get mending in challenge worlds where certain biomes are omitted. I agree with the statement that it's too easy and random to get the best enchantment in the game, but I think this might be too harsh of a nerf for those who are really into maxing out their gear. But then again, maybe the philosophy behind this is to discourage the maxing-out of gear, as mending eliminates the whole aspect of mining for ores once every tool has it. However, "grinders" seem to amount to a significant chunk of the playerbase, and should thus be catered to. This update would give worldbuilders like myself more incentive to build a world, but disincentivize grinders to obtain ultimate power.

    Basically, what I'm trying to say is, this change doesn't please everybody. While that's an impossible thing to do with a playerbase as diverse as Minecraft, I think a more well-rounded update to librarian trades is needed. I don't know what that could be, and I don't have the time to figure it out, but I know a better solution is out there.

    Concerning the Wandering Traders, it's a net positive to make them cheaper and give them trades where they pay you. I never tested it out, but if you have to give him an entire water/milk bucket -- bucket included -- for only 2 emeralds, that might need a reconsideration.

  • 49
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    The changes to the librarian would absolutely ruin the utility of villager trading halls. But the having to earn the better enchantments requiring diamond tier would not be too bad.

  • 1
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    I like this in concept but not in execution. Reducing how overpowered librarians are is a good idea, but just doesn't work when two of the most useful enchantments are locked behind villagers that can only be obtained by curing zombie villagers (which are rare enough as it is) that spawn in jungle and swamp biomes, and I doubt many players even realize that these villagers exist. On top of that, the master level books not being max level means that players are even more likely to end up hitting the arbitrary enchantment limit from combining books to achieve max enchants, which doesn't do anything except force players to use trial and error, or look up a calculator online to find the best order. The wandering trader stuff is pretty much fine as it is here, since now you don't have to find emeralds to trade with them, which makes them more useful in the early game. The pickaxe trade does feel a bit incongruous though. Overall my suggestions would be to remove the anvil cap and/or make the master books max level, and either add naturally generated jungle and swamp villages, or allow zombie villagers of any biome type to spawn in any biome (this would also fix the issues this change creates on superflat and skyblock and other similar challenges).

  • 0
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    I'm okay with nerfing librarians but biome depending books? It doesn't make a lot of sense to me. As someone mentioned, it'll become impossible to get some books in superflat world. Also most players like having all their villagers in one place and it's usually very hard to transport them. I don't know, for me it seems unnecessary hard. Wandering trader changes are great, I'm almost never buying anything from them but I'm sure going to sell something.

  • 4
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    No matter what you decide to do, please implement Jungle and Swamp Villages. (Jungle Village = Tree House Village?)


    And make the Jungle Villages be defended by Kung Fu Pandas lol

  • 1
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    Pros:
    - Librarians offering certain enchantments in specific biomes reduces the time spent gambling for a desired enchantment. Want mending? You know where to look.*

    Cons:
    - Jungles and Swamps do not naturally contain Villagers, and creating a village from scratch is tedious and frustrating.
    - *Finding the biome you need is not a guarantee, and, in Superflat, it is impossible.
    - Getting a desired enchantment trade still has an element of gambling, and the possibility of duplicate trades exacerbates this.
    - Expert Librarians not offering max. level enchantments requires the player to combine low level books in an anvil instead. For items which require many enchantments like boots or helmets, the anvil cost for using these combined books becomes too expensive and impossible. 

    Rebalancing:
    - Jungles and Swamps should contain their own villages. This is an opportunity to create structures with bamboo or mangrove wood.
    - If a biome's village is an important part of progression, there should be a reliable way to locate it. Try offering biome specific Village Explorer Maps from Cartographers. Think of this like the Villager giving you the business card of a guy they know.
    - Do not allow duplicate trades. This could be fixed by guaranteeing each Librarian offers every one of their enchantments.
    - Multiplicative anvil cost for combining or adding enchantments should be removed. The cost of adding an enchantment should be fixed whether you are adding it to a tool with many or no enchantments.

  • 0
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    I love idea of certain enchantments being locked to certain levels, but not certain biomes. The biomes makes it impossible to get some trades from villagers in certain words (like super flat or some versions of skyblock, or others that I can’t think of) where the whole world is a single biome. Also, getting rid of the highest level enchantments is a great idea, if the anvil system is reworked. Otherwise, it could be too easy to run into the xp limit. And my final note is that the trident enchantments being removed is disappointing. With crossbows and fishing rods, you can get the enchantments easily from the fletcher and fisherman, but the trident doesn’t have a villager, locking it’s enchantments to be loot and enchantment table exclusive. In skyblock words, that would require getting diamonds from an end city before you could enchant a trident.

  • 0
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    Moving villagers is currently a nightmare as you have to deal with their AI, and try to force them into minecarts to carry them any significant distance. If villagers were easier to transport, this would maybe make sense. Otherwise, this just adds a ton of tedium to the game. Also concerned about players who do not have all of the biomes near them necessary for some of the enchantments.

  • 119
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    I do not like this change, all it does is make trading (which is already annoying) more tedious and annoying.

  • 0
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    100% agree with the changes to wandering traders. With the exception of super-flat smp's, they have really only been useful as an early game source of slimeballs, pufferfish, and leads (with the latter being a perhaps unintended method of obtaining).

    However, for the librarian trade changes, there are a number of problems with it.

    Pros

    • More reasons to visit other biomes
    • Makes villagers less overpowered
    • Creates a reason to build in other biomes

    Cons

    • Can make it difficult for new players to obtain enchanting books in particular with villages that don't actually naturally generate
    • Makes it tedious for seasoned players
    • Moving villagers is a PAIN
    • "Too Expensive" anvil flag could make some enchantment combinations downright impossible (looking at you swords, boots, and helmets).
    • Superflat worlds just are impossible now

    I believe that there could be a pretty simple solution to this however. Make jungle villages naturally spawn (using the new bamboo wood). And make swamp villages naturally spawn in mangrove swamps (using the corresponding wood). This would encourage exploration, one of the goals of trails and tales, and would also not force new players to travel villagers long distance and set up breeders.

    Then, all you need to do is lower anvil combination costs in order to allow low-level books from villagers to be combined.

    The as is changes are really not great, but with tuning, they could fix quite a few issues with villagers in general.

  • 0
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    I think you all focus on the wrong way of making the end game gear more "rewarding". You shouldn't make it harder to get what we have now, you should add actual higher goals and better stuff so that the best gear is just a whole lot better and actually hard to get from the get go, this could be done with certain extra bosses some upgrades or new unique enchants that unlock by having an item or new expensive bookcase near your enchanting table. Making what we already have harder to get just makes it more boring to get and not more rewarding since people remember the easy times. I really advise against these changes since it just becomes nore boring and technical to know and keep track of all these things for a game you want to keep simple. Either you make it too technical and boring or you make it interesting and more rewarding with NEW REWARDS that are actually better then anything you could get right now.

  • 0
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    Ok I have very mixed feelings about the new villager trading.

    1. I do think there is a slight problem with villager trading as it stands because if you set up a simple infecting system and breeder you can get insane amounts of things from villagers. BUT this is definitely not the solution. 

    2. I do like the wandering trader changes because in my experience it can be difficult to get them to spawn if I need them and them being forced to despawn and the trade locking makes it very fair to have these changes.

    3. The approach that Mojang is taking to solve the villager issue is by nerfing what you can get with villagers but instead I think a better approach would be to make it more difficult to achieve getting villagers. Especially with superflat players it makes it harder if not impossible to get those trades. But if there were extra steps involved and there wasn't as many emerald trades that could allow for infinite emeralds then this would be something good.

    4. Re-reading their reasoning there is also slight lore for librarians which I understand but if you want to make lore for them rather than changing what enchanted books they sell, add other items that are related to the lore that you want them to have.

  • 0
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    I like the idea of the villager changes, in that it reduces RNG and encourages you to explore the world and build things instead of breaking and placing a lectern over and over. I also think it's better to make it a little harder to get good enchantments.

    However, it's quite difficult to move villagers to new biomes. If you get unlucky, you may not have any villages near a Swamp or Jungle and have to spend a bunch of time transporting villagers, perhaps even through the Nether, which is not fun.

    There needs to be an alternate way of getting villagers of a particular biome. Why don't villagers check for a nearby wood type? You would be encouraged to build different kinds of houses for your different kinds of villagers. For example, if there's Mangrove Wood nearby, a new baby villager will have a chance of being a Swamp villager. Jungle or Bamboo Wood could make Jungle villagers. Dead Bushes or Cacti could make Desert villagers. It could work similarly to how de-zombifying villagers speeds up if there are Iron Bars nearby. This would also solve the problem of certain enchantments being impossible to get in Single Biome or Superflat worlds, since you can get the saplings from Wandering Traders.

    Also, if you're going to make it so we can't directly get Efficiency/Sharpness V or Protection IV or Unbreaking III books, you really really need to do something about the prior work modifier on anvils. Make it cap off or just remove it entirely.

    Thanks for reading.

  • 2
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    What this will do for me in singleplayer is just make me ignore librarians and enchant normally, except mending. 

    In multiplayer there is generally a balance of few players spending the time to do enchanted villager trades for shops and stuff so I only really see it making that harder to get into/less competitive where I feel like newer players will feel disadvantaged or like there is less available to them.

    This also clashes heavily with the unintuitive anvil combination cost mechanics that make it harder for newer players to get the enchants they want on gear.

     

  • 1
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    I hate this idea. It makes everything to do with librarians and how to get good trade so much harder for new and experienced players. However I do agree with the specialty books being locked to masters. What I think they should do is keep the book level (I, II, III, IV, V) lower, like they are implementing but get rid of the biome dependent trades.

    Basically lower book levels, as Mojang has implemented, and keep the 7 speciality books locked to masters so you would have to trade your librarians to max to have a chance at 1 of the 7 speciality books. Just don't do biome dependent trades please. 

    Keeping the zombie curing discount to once per villager is a good idea and nerfs trading halls perfectly.

  • 0
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    I apologize for the onslaught of ideas but I've been thinking about this for a while.

    I think that you should find books in the world and give them to the villager in order to trade for that book. The villager level should determine the enchant level, and the village happiness should determine your price.

    Likewise, I also believe that the Armorers and Smiths should give Iron Blocks because of Village Happiness as a thank you to not having to create as many Iron Golems.

    I think there should also be a florist job that allows easier duplication of flowers, whose job site allows for a player to contain 4 small flowers in a single block.

    A happiness/Respect level would allow a player to cultivate their own villager population however, interfere with the concept of a trading hall. The higher the player's respect, the more the villager will listen: become easier to move, stick to player chosen path blocks, stick to an assigned house. This might be done with a mayor block. 

  • 126
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    This idea &ucks!  Fire whoever came up with this idea IMMEDIATELY!!!

    Villagers are already difficult to deal with, now you want us to move villagers (not one but TWO villagers, at the very least) over 1,000s or 10,000s of blocks and set up MULTIPLE trading halls!!!  This also means multiple bases, multiple farms!!! ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!! You are already forcing me/us (newer players) into DEADLY bastions!!!  ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!! 

    NO!! NO!! NO!!