The latest snapshot/preview includes experimental changes to the wandering trader and librarian trades, which we're introducing to rebalance the villager trade system. Here's a look at what's changed:
Librarian
Before these changes, players could get any village enchantment from any librarian. A novice librarian could sell the best enchantment in the game! For some players, this felt too random and made trading feel overpowered when compared to using the enchanting table or searching for enchanted books in structures.
With the new rules, librarians from different biomes sell different enchantments, and each village biome has one enchantment that is only sold by master librarians.
Players will have to work towards getting the best trades instead of relying on random chance. We hope this makes librarian trading more interesting and skilful, while also revealing some clues about their history of each village type through the enchantments that are sold there.
Wandering Trader
Some players felt that the Wandering Trader had unfair prices and didn't sell many useful items. We have lowered their prices, added more trades and increased the amounts available. The Wandering Trader will also now buy useful items from players, so it's possible to help them on their journey by giving them supplies even if you don't feel like buying anything.
As this is an experiment, we would really appreciate your feedback as work continues and to help us decide on the future direction for villager trades!
Post is closed for comments.
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The Good:
- Enchanted book trades are now biome-dependent, instead of randomised: This is great! It removes the random element and encourages the player to set up multiple bases and build stuff in more areas of their world. Brilliant change.
The Bad:
- Villagers now no longer sell certain enchantments, and will no longer sell some enchantments at max level: The entire reason players build villager trading halls is to reliably get max-level enchantments without the fuss of using a enchanting table that cannot produce some max-level enchants. If a player can't get Impaling/Quick Draw/etc. though trading, they have to use the enchanting table, and the enchanting table sucks even worse than villagers do in a lot of respects. Don't limit the max level of villager enchants, and don't remove any enchants they have already. They're not fun or interesting changes like the biome dependency is.
The Ugly:
- You can only get a discount from curing a zombie villager once: If you're going to do this, at least increase the discount so players used to the old system don't just feel cheated.
- Wandering traders have slightly more valuable trades: Not good enough. They're still probably gonna be free leads most of the time. Just have them sell biome locator maps so players don't use seed maps to find all their biomes for trading.
- No changes to the enchanting table: The enchanting table sucks and it needs a buff, ESPECIALLY if you're nerfing villager trading.
Villager Trading needed a nerf for a long time, but I don't think that this is the way to go. The biome specific trades for the liberian are just tedious. If you just want to have some decent enchants, you need a crazy amount of XP and a stupendous amount of time to get the last few enchants that you did not get from enchanting (which should be also buffed/changed in the same update). For some enchants this system could actually be a decent nerf (like mending), but I think that other important books should not be locked behind a biome trade (like efficiency, sharpness or protection).
I also think that it would be a better nerf, if the good enchants (like mending or sharpness) are just only locked behind the masters trades. This would make trading just a bit more time consuming and would still nerf liberian a decent bit.
Another thing I want to mention is that I think raid farms should be nerfed in some ways (not saying that they should be removed from the game entirely), so you don't get a unlimited amount of emeralds.
And if emeralds are harder to obtain, than e.g. a unbreaking III book for 20 emeralds is alot more expensive.
But I do have to say that the zombified villager curing and the Wandering Trader changes are pretty good.
Love the idea about the wandering traders but please keep normal villagers the same for the sake of casual players like myself. I wouldn’t be able to have as much fun while playing Minecraft if I had to make trading halls in every biome and waste so much more time energy and experience levels while playing casually.
This sounds like a fun incentive to build Swamp and Jungle villages! However, if this goes through, I think we should get an easier way to mobilize the villagers to said new villages. I can understand not wanting players to put leashes on them, but perhaps they should follow players who are holding an emerald in their hand?
Awful change, I don't think the devs realise that a lot of players see the enchantments as something that unlocks the rest of the game instead of being something to slowly work towards. Lots of people on starting a new world will get max gear, defeat the enderdragon and get a max beacon and then start "playing", this just makes it so much more difficult to get through early game grind. It's like the devs think max gear should be a goal that you might achieve in a really long term world (talking years) rather than most survival worlds which I feel is a disconnect from the players. Netherrite was ok, added another long grind for completionists but didn't make achieving the old max any harder so in a lot of ways you could just ignore it and luckily the trims are only cosmetic so also unnecessary to obtain each playthrough but this just makes things more difficult. I don't want to spend 30 hours getting max gear in each world before I can start playing the game, and nor does anyone else. And the anvil situation is going to be hell
The only one I completely disagree with is Biome specific trades. ABSOLUTELY not. that would take way too much work.
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These changes aren't bad like people say they are; they just expose deeper flaws with Minecraft's enchant system.
As for the changes themselves, I still feel like librarians have too much RNG. I would like it if each biome's librarian had a set list of trades for each level, having every enchant included at 1 level below the maximum. The price should also not be randomized as it is still the case that the same enchantment can cost anywhere from 19 emeralds to a full stack. This is even worse since we can't repeatedly cure villagers.
As far as the enchant system itself, I feel that an overhaul is long overdue. Here's what I'd change:
I would prefer if Anvil's XP costs would scale linearly(or not at all) based on the number of enchantments already on that item, not times worked. This way, no matter how you combine, it'll have about the same cost. Combining books of the same enchant to increase level shouldn't add to times worked so it's still possible to get max gear without starting with max books.(this would be necessary if villagers don't sell them)
The enchant table also needs a full overhaul. I would like if they added a third slot which can accept various magical items. When you enchant an item with one of these, it adds a corresponding enchant that is not affected by rng or what enchants the item already has, unless it would conflict.(IE: Fire charges give fire aspect, end crystals give mending, etc.)
I welcome this change. However, please consider removing the TOO EXPENSIVE! limit on anvils. It would make getting fully enchanted armour less tedious, especially with this villager trading update.
I love that you are rebalancing villagers and wandering traders. I've found that due to how difficult it is to get emeralds without exploits I rarely ever interact with villagers. I like all the changes you made.
Even with this I still feel like casual players will probably not interact with villagers. I can identify two key issues that discourage me and my friends from interacting with villagers: Clunky interactions, and high investment requirements.
Villagers are tedious to work with. Transporting them is unintuitive, costly, and frustrating. Unlike the majority of mobs, villagers' movement cannot be controlled without minecarts. And breaking workstations to reset trades is time consuming, boring work, in a game that already has a lot of busy work.
Unless you build a massive trade hall 99% of trades are useless to a casual player. It feels like emeralds are too hard to acquire, and the cost of goods and blocks seems too expensive. My expectation for villager trading is that it would allow me to convert resources I've gained from one area of Minecraft to another area in a ineffective but convenient way. (I.e. being able to trade mined cobble for bonemeal, through a series of trades).
The changes implemented here do a decent job at tweaking the requirements to make use of villagers, but I feel they lack changes that make the system appealing for casual players. I would love to see further changes to villager bartering and interacting with villagers.
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In recent versions, for many experienced players Minecraft's progression system has been entirely defined by rushing a villager trading hall. Librarian max enchanted book trades, along with the potential for one emerald diamond gear, makes villager trades the most viable way to get max enchanted gear by an incredibly long shot. Villagers are so efficient, to the point where every other method of progression is basically obsolete.
In that way, villagers limit gameplay. Despite having enchantment tables, fishing, and exploring/looting to upgrade your gear, the only thing that's worth pursuing is villagers. For that reason, I believe nerfing villagers would be a solid change to the game.Specifically, being able to cure villagers multiple times was just overpowered, so fixing that seems good to me! The idea of splitting enchantments up by biome seems like a really appealing and interesting mechanic too! I don't love that lots of the librarians most valuable enchantments would get capped below their max level, but I suppose that might be a necessary change.
However, I believe there are currently some limitations that could make these changes flat-out annoying to deal with. It is incredibly tedious to move villagers long distances, so setting up biome villages would not be a fun experience. Additionally, anvils reach their "too expensive" limit too early as is, so having to combine multiple non-maxed books together could make it impossible to get max gear.Please do not do this.
The loss of max enchantments will force players to loop through the enchantment table repeatedly, as the lower level books cannot be realistically combined to create max level enchants. As Lapis is not efficiently renewable, this will also mean that reaching endgame, which was already extended by the netherite changes, will now be a marathon away.
In addition, the fixed trades will make trading much more stale, and having to find biomes to change the trades will mean that trading can no longer be a feature of bases, which many players depend on.
There are better ways to manage scarcity of treasure enchants like mending. Please do not do this.I would suggest rebalancing the Anvil xp cost. As it is currently xp is not a great system. Considering without making a guardian farm or a Enderman farm Xp can take a while to get to level 30+. Which is now required with the proposed changes to acquire the best tools possible.
This is an awful idea for superflat players and players who don't have 30 hours to move villagers to different biomes
I personally do not like the Librarian trade nerf. I understand the reasoning behind implementing something, and I'll even agree that it does need to be nerfed in some way. HOWEVER, this is not the way to do it in my opinion.
Moving villagers is a real pain in the butt. Moving villagers to a jungle/swamp, and then likely breeding them, in order to get their trades will be tedious and time consuming. Moreover, then moving them back to a trading hall or base would double that effort and time commitment.
What if you don't have a swamp within 10,000 blocks of spawn or your base? No Mending? Or a painful experience to get it anyway. Same goes for a jungle. Does that mean no Feather Falling or Power enchant for your bow?
I agree with others in saying that this will make it more difficult and confusing for new players, and more frustrating for experienced players and content creators, who are really the ones doing most of your advertising.
Please re-evaluate this concept and consider an alternative method of nerfing the way we get enchantments. Additionally, it might be less controversial in the community to focus on something more "in demand". Maybe something like an inventory update, or a new biome/existing biome update.
I have always had Mojang's back with their updates, and defended them fully against all the backlash, but I cannot say the same if this experiment is implemented into the game.
首先，我理解对图书管理员进行平衡调整的目的。
但若如现版本的方案修改，由于铁砧过于昂贵、附魔书获取复杂等原因，玩家对于使用村民交易获取附魔书的意愿将会极大打消。
而培养足够的村民用于获取顶级装备，实际上和附魔台的成本并无过大差异。村民交易的上限下调并不会使获取第一套顶级装备的成本改变，相反会使重复获取顶级装备成本急剧上升。附魔台在这种需要大量顶级装备的情况下，这种纯概率的重复劳作很容易使得玩家产生厌烦，并对难以获得优秀装备的情况进行归因，从而对游戏流程厌烦。尽管这个情况并不出现在大多数玩家身上，但由于这个方案并未对大部分玩家产生质变，因此我认为这个方案的效果并不正面。可以在维持上限的情况下将下限上调。这里提出几个方案：
1. 维持群系对附魔书种类的差异的改动或采用其他方案，回调可获取附魔书的等级上限。
2. 图书管理员不再贩卖附魔书，取而代之的是村民被雷击中不再成为女巫时根据职业变为变种村民，图书管理员变为巫术师，由巫术师贩卖附魔书。可以适当增加变种村民与村民的行为差异。
3. 村民改为贩卖附魔书范本，无法直接使用，需要玩家在附魔台上花费相较于随机附魔更多的成本进行激活。
4.图书管理员不再贩卖附魔书。新增新职业贩卖魔力相关物品，以附魔台为职业方块。工作时间，若达成一定结构，可花费一定物品产出附魔书，如同农民进行耕种一样。
同时，作为一位技术生存玩家，我以我自己角度的提出建议：
可加入深海、地下、地狱、幽匿等地区的异种村民，来获取三叉戟、钓竿、灵魂疾行、快速潜行的附魔书。这可以增加世界的丰富度，尽管这会带来更多的工作量。此外，对于过往版本的锻造模板。我清楚目的是为了增加钻石到合金甲的时间，但合成模板需要进行大量的重复工作，而这之中并没有足够的反馈来让这个过程本身变得有趣，这会使玩家很快厌烦这一过程。希望可以适当降低升级模板复制的支出，即更改合成表或钻石可再生。以及装饰用模板的支出与收入不成正比，希望可以降低成本或增加装饰收益(如装备效果)
最后，尽管作为一个游戏流程，平衡与节奏是重要的。但我认为《Minecraft》的核心并不在于生存中的游戏节奏，大可以不必在这之上投入过多精力。可以增加世界的丰富度以诱导玩家探索，玩家可以在游戏流程之外自行探索感兴趣的区域，而不是一味增加流程长度。Capping enchantments at lower than max levels (such as efficiency only going up to 3) will make the whole point of librarians meaningless. Players put in the extra work to get villager infrastructure because it has advantages over the enchanting table. But when I can put my pickaxe in the table and get a better tool instantly I will never ever bother with librarians again. My suggestion is to keep efficiency and the other ‘special’ enchants in the master tier trade BUT randomize the level all the way up to max. This way you can still have that efficiency 3 trade there but players can still have the chance to get max level and encourage them to bother with librarians again. Either that or fix the anvil book combining because I’m not going to bother with efficiency 3 when I could end up with the anvil telling me “Too expensive!”
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While I think nerfing librarian trades is a good step overall, the execution isn't.
Locking content to biomes does more harm than good most of the time, exploring to find new biomes is hard in older worlds, it makes it harder for challenge players to play, and overall makes the game less enjoyable for everyone, The wandering trader, however you see it, was a fix for that.
But now this update tells players what biomes they can and cannot settle down in. Want a source for mending? build a base in a swamp and stay there.
This discourages players from playing how they want, which goes against what Minecraft was built around
A solution to this problem could be scaling enchants for librarians, 1st book has no treasure enchants, and is guaranteed to be tier I. the 2nd book is entirely random, any enchant, at any level. The 3rd book is a random max level enchant, including treasure enchants like mending. Finally, the 4th book is a max level enchant version of the first book, this however, is traded in emerald blocks, preventing players from just zombifying/curing a villager over and over again to get a one-emerald trade.
If you really want to nerf trading, which should be nerfed, I agree, add some sort of happiness system so villagers aren't just locked up in halls and used as glorified crafting stations.
Talking from my perspective from a superflat world. Last updates feels like adding more unavailable stuff for me. Diamonds are very hard to get and they are not renewable. Crafting templates for netherite upgrade is really hard. Almost all new staff: bamboo, trims, deep slate, skulks, suspicious sand, sniffers, camels, biome-specific mobs and many-many more are simply unobtainable at all. Please, make my personal (and game intended) sandbox experience hard, but not impossible. I want to experience and use new features too.
Librarian:
It's bad. I simply don't have any biomes except of plains. So most enchantment books will be unavailable to me. Sure, I can try to use an enchanting table, but building a breeder/trading hall to get exactly what I want is already significant task with a big reward in the end.
Wandering Trader:
New changes is useful, but maybe you could add something more with a different mechanic. Something that is hardly obtainable in planes (bamboo, diamonds, petals, other non-renewable resources) can be shown when you'll buy everything that he provides initially. Like experience system for the villagers. It would be not perfect even like this, but it'll help players who can't explore in my case and don't want to explore in other cases.
I like the idea behind these changes but the grind to get enchantments was already quite difficult, being a multi-hour long process. These changes are JUST nerfs, no buffs to things like enchanting tables or similar. This means that enchantments are getting to be more locked behind extreme grinding. I would be much more on board with these changes if experience was easier to come by (maybe manually harvesting crops, or adding a system where you get more XP for killing a more diverse selection of mobs to give people without mob grinders a chance to do well?), I would be much more on board with these changes, but as of now it feels like this takes an already grindy and frustrating system and makes it even more grindy and frustrating.
It’s allready tedious enough to replace the lecturn over and over and this new update would make that still exist but just make the whole villager progress way more tedious. Why not go the other way and add a trade refresh button like some mods have already done? The not being able to cure villagers over and over again for way too cheap trades is a good addition though because you get enough emeralds from raid farms for more expensive trades to not really be much of an issue anyway.
I think for regular survival, this is a great balance because the librarian trades are a bit op (and somewhat boring to get, mindlessly placing and breaking a lectern to get the book you want isn't exactly fun). And with this giving another reason to explore more, it's overall just great... but... for us super flat players, this takes away a lot of possibilities for us! I understand we are not high up on your priority list when it comes to balancing and making changes, but I would appreciate if you took us at least a bit under consideration. I can't say I know a way to well balance the trades while accounting for super flat players, but if you think there could be a way, it would be great if you were to look into it :]
I think the change is fundamentally good, but as implemented it adds a lot of tedium. I don't want to go through the effort of moving two villagers a possibly very far distance just to get three librarians. If more villagers had biome specific trades it might go from an annoyance to a big project. I really like how it limits the pool of possible trades for a given villager- no more thirty minutes repeatedly breaking and placing a lecturn!
The wandering trader is still just as useless as ever in normal gameplay, but I do like that you can sell items to them! All I ask is a lava bucket trade. Pretty please.
Please remember that in Java Edition Villagers aren´t always born with the appearance of the biome they spawned in, but instead they´ll sometimes inherit the appearance of their parents. If you implement this change, please make sure to fix this as it would make getting Swamp appearance Villagers unnecesarily more tedious.
Maybe it´d be good to consider making villagers able to change appearance if their bed or workplace changes biome tooI do like the change initially in concept, but in execution I think it could be reworked a bit. While dedicated trades assigned to each biome is a very unique idea, this simply cannot apply to worlds that are superflat or servers with massive hardware constraints. If this change is to be implemented, I would suggest having a setting that would enable it in the first place, like a slider. This way players could choose whether they would like to have this balance change instantiated or not on their world.
Furthermore, I do think the items traded should include those that are fishing, trident, and crossbow related. Making these trades also biome specific perhaps would make for an interesting concept as well.
Of most of the (currently 78) comments most of them say that this change is a bad idea and I heavily disagree with those people. Making book trades biome dependent incentivizes the core aspects of Minecraft, exploration and building (especially in the Swamp and Jungle). Additionaly the claim that it is unintuitive for new players is ridiculous since a new player would eventually notice that some librarians sell one sort of enchanted book while'st others sell completely different ones. The only way they would not realize that is if they did quite literally no exploration at all, which with Minecraft's beatiful terrain is a ridiculous assumption. The old system of re-rolling Librarians could be said to be even more unintuitive than the system they are introducing now. I wholy agree that Superflat would need to be excempt from this change, since it already is hard enough for those players. I most heavily agree with Mending being locked behind Swamp Villagers since the old re-rolling system made that, what is supposed to be an, end-game enchantment too easy to obtain, since you could can get it way too early (I was able to get it within an hour of survival gameplay). Furthermore their crying that they can't get an OP enchantment within an hour, is just that, inmature crying. Lastly, I want to say that I feel like they don't realize that any of the old Villagers they have, will keep their trades (so they just can set up their op trading hall in 1.20.1 and then update).
I enjoy these changes for librarian as someone who had to set up librarian trading for mending, fortune and few others. But I think this moves the bottleneck with enchanting system to Anvil and Experience system. To fix these I believe Anvil's level cap should be increased/removed and/or every level of experience should require the same amount of experience (between 40-50 maybe?). Enchanting table should be a more enticing option by giving you 4 choices. Increasing the amount of experience players drop on death would also help as currently if you die with 30 levels you only get 5 back, which might mean some players are unable to use the system.
I agree that the current way Librarians work with the whole "placing and breaking a lectern for hours until you get Mending or Unbreaking III" is not really fun or enjoyable gameplay wise, and I'm all for changing how it works to break up the pool of books, but the way this update is laid out gives me a few concerns:
1) I don't like how the method of obtaining different biomes' villagers works given this update: It would be beyond tedious to lug a Villager thousands of blocks for a couple minutes, just to lug it's child back home. It definitely makes the whole process more interactive, but the level of monotony is the same if not worse depending on where certain biomes spawn. Instead, allow villagers to breed into new versions outside of their traditional biomes (maybe something where a certain amount/type of blocks in the breeding space cause them to breed that biome's villager?) I think the way villagers worked previously was fine for the completionists out there looking to get them all, but forcing players to do it makes not quite as enjoyable, and also takes away from the accomplishment of the people who did it for fun.
2) I don't like that, after putting in all that effort, you can't even get max level enchantments- I would make it a minimum level with a potential for higher levels.
3) I think Jungle and Swamp villages should actually exist if you want to force these changes, make it worth looking for
and 4) include the cut books
Hopefully this helps improve the update ^^
A few points on this:
1: "A novice librarian could sell the best enchantment in the game!"
Allowing the player to see the future trades, much like a skill tree, of each villager would save a lot of frustration and time with villager farms/trading posts. With that, I want to see that villagers cannot trade powerful enchanted books until later levels. Possibly, mending would only be a master villager trade option.
2: "With the new rules, librarians from different biomes sell different enchantments, and each village biome has one enchantment that is only sold by master librarians"
This biome related part of the update is nonsense and really does not improve the player experience. That's the goal, right? The end game of Minecraft is not making multi-dimension railways for villagers just to have a trading area in a more convenient place in the world. The struggle is not worth the reward. A XP farm and an enchanting table will do the trick given enough time. (Less time than a massive villager trafficking mission)
3: "Wandering Trader"
Everything said here about the wondering trader is a very good improvement. It is very rare to ever see a wondering trader that is worth more than the lead and alpaca it could provide me.Registered User commentedComment actions Permalink- Edited
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If we want players to enjoy playing games more and invest more time in them, the focus shouldn't be on extending the tedious aspects of the gameplay or making convenient things more complicated. Instead, we should aim to enhance the fun and enjoyment of the game.
If you want to have more quality content, you can try combining Elytra with Armor, as well as standing Slabs.
I personally dont like this
this will only work if you finally give us villages in the biomes where villages dont spawn like the jungle and the swamp.
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