The latest snapshot/preview includes experimental changes to the wandering trader and librarian trades, which we're introducing to rebalance the villager trade system. Here's a look at what's changed:
Librarian
Before these changes, players could get any village enchantment from any librarian. A novice librarian could sell the best enchantment in the game! For some players, this felt too random and made trading feel overpowered when compared to using the enchanting table or searching for enchanted books in structures.
With the new rules, librarians from different biomes sell different enchantments, and each village biome has one enchantment that is only sold by master librarians.
Players will have to work towards getting the best trades instead of relying on random chance. We hope this makes librarian trading more interesting and skilful, while also revealing some clues about their history of each village type through the enchantments that are sold there.
Wandering Trader
Some players felt that the Wandering Trader had unfair prices and didn't sell many useful items. We have lowered their prices, added more trades and increased the amounts available. The Wandering Trader will also now buy useful items from players, so it's possible to help them on their journey by giving them supplies even if you don't feel like buying anything.
As this is an experiment, we would really appreciate your feedback as work continues and to help us decide on the future direction for villager trades!
Post is closed for comments.
-
Librarian Changes
The new villager trading changes make the game seem more tedious. A Positive change instead of this disaster would be locking trades behind reputation. Where a player would need to retrieve something a Villager requested. Thus gaining reputation and unlocking another level. I agree some books should be locked behind higher level reputation, instead of getting Fortune 3 or Efficiency 5 as a Tier 1 trade, they should be locked behind higher level Tiers.
Forcing players to move villagers to new biomes, will ultimately create more lag and stress of servers. It also leaves a person to wonder if Minecraft Developers are telling us they will never create Swamp Villages, or Jungle Villages.. if the message we are reading from this update is telling us to "create these villages yourself*.Wandering Trader Changes & Additional Trades
This is actually such a good step forward, and I really hope there is more positive changes to trades like this. I really wish this snapshot/update would also include changes to other villager professions, and perhaps even adding Villager Professions. Right now Stone Masons are such a joke, I don't know one person who is hyped about a Stone Mason, their trades are all laughable, this profession needs such an improvement.I don't quite like these experimental changes
For one if certain enchants are made biome exclusive to master librarians, then all biomes with exclusive enchantments should have villages that naturally generate within them.
Two spreading out enchantments like this feels tedious and too RNG dependant, I agree with making better enchant trades behind more proficient villagers that is fine to me, but then locking it behind biomes which may be ages away from a player can just be tedious, and without a third party way to locate certain biomes, you just might be locked out because you were unlucky and dont have, say a jungle biome for 3000 blocks from your base
Removing some RNG or adding more player agency/options to the enchantment system may be better
Removing the level limit on anvils
New ways to influence what enchantments you can get from enchanting, via more specialized structures in enchanting stations or other methods to influence it to try and get enchantments the player wants r build better gear, maybe making loss of enchanted tools not as big of a loss so mending becomes amazing to have perma-tools but makes it to be less of a necessity
tl;dr the librarian rework makes it way harder for new players, and more tedious for experienced or advanced players, without addressing the current issues with the enchantment system, expanding on enchantment and trading overall I think is a net positive, I just dont think this is the right way to do it. Though I like the WT change, Very gudIf you're going to make mending infinitely harder to find, then remove the xp cost from repairing items in an anvil. I should be able to repair my tools with diamonds without using xp, IF mending is going to be ultimately impossible to get.
Registered User commentedComment actions Permalink- Edited
- Report a Concern
- Comment actions Permalink
I fully support the new wandering villager trades, but the books being limited to certain biomes is odd since in order to create a good villager trading hall or to get a place to access all enchanted books with ease you have to most likely transport villagers hundreds of blocks to the biome necessary for the books you need, trade with them until you are guaranteed to have everything at a somewhat affordable price (or best possible price if that is what you are looking for) and lastly take the villagers (most likely) thousands of blocks back to your base to have them in a nearby location. Nothing necessarily wrong with this but it feels like if you are able to go through the trouble of doing all that so that you can enchant all your tools you are most likely already in the endgame and thus dont need them anymore.
Edit: Also, since im leaving my thoughts, i think wandering traders should have roughly the same possible amounts of things to buy as they do to sell. As to balance out and make it possible to obtain emeralds easier early game.Registered User commentedComment actions Permalink- Edited
- Report a Concern
- Comment actions Permalink
The intent is not bad, but the idea needs some refinements. For example, it implies a heavier use of anvils, which mechanics are still pretty broken. So this change would also need an anvil rework in my opinion (well it needed to be worked on even before this change, but this is an incentive). There are some other complications others mentioned, but I don't think leaving villager trades in the state they are now is good either. People who say otherwise just got used to the old system and like the easy grind of powerful enchantments (would like to listen to different opinions tho). I will say, this is a good starting idea, but as all starting ideas, it should be affected to changes based on community suggestions and requests. Eventually, we could get to a point where the full fleshed out changes could become really good for the majority of the playerbase. And if these are the terms in which it shall be done, I'm all for it tbh
Registered User commentedComment actions Permalink- Edited
- Report a Concern
- Comment actions Permalink
I consider the fix treatment of residents to be a positive thing. But I don't like the complication of getting enchanted books. I propose to leave the limitations of biomes only for mending and durability in the jungle and swamps, respectively, and leave the rest of the bidding as it was.
Terrible idea
I love the concept of this change! It was always a pain to reset the villager 40 times to get the book you want; replacing that with actual gameplay of having to move and bread villagers across the map is brilliant; you actually have to play the game "as intended". I would build on this where each "level" of the villager trades had a higher level of enchantments - with the master always selling the highest level, not "unbreaking 2"As for the discount, I would love it if that got more complex, for example- "Hero of the village" - 30% discount- healed in the last X days - 20% discount- can path find to work station - 10% discount- can path find to own/unassigned bed - 10% discount- can path find to "enclosed"/"safe" space - 10% discount- can path find to X other villagers - 10% discountThat way, you can still get very cheap trades, but you have to work for it; the biggest discounts reset periodically, and the standard ones require you to build a "real" village instead of just trapping them in a 1x1 box. But maybe only run those checks at the start of the working day so villagers don't slow the game down too much.I think it’s a good idea to make certain book trades for librarians only accessible when they are leveled up multiple times. I don’t think it’s a good idea to make books biome specific though, I think this will just make the game more frustrating to play.
I like the changes to wandering traders, but the biome specific trading and level caps are excessive and make game play too tedious. I think a better fix would be to scale enchantments with the librarian's level. So, a level 1 enchant would be available at level 1 for the librarians and a level 5 enchant is available for level 5 librarians. This stops people from getting the best enchantments right away, but still makes it so trading halls aren't a horrible grind.
While I do think villagers could use a rework, I feel this is one of the worst ways to go by it, as much as I like that each biome has its trades, I normally don't find all biomes in a playthrough, since exploring too much usually lags the server I'm playing on and makes world files way too bloated (not to mention I don't enjoy looking for biomes); That also introduces problems for superflat players, that don't even have the luxury of different biomes. More technical players (like me) also take a huge hit from this, as this change renders villager automations completely unviable and useless, eliminating another fun way to interact with the trading mechanic.
Decreasing the sold enchantments level is what I think is the biggest problem here, since the anvil not only gets exponentially more expensive, but also (still) has a hard cap for enchanting! A mechanic that pretty much forced players to use villagers to get the best enchantments in the first place.
So in my opinion, this rework feels sort of incomplete, it either needs an anvil/experience buff/rework or to not happen at all to be honest...
Complete garbage, villagers are already a huge pain to do them correctly, and are very essential to the gameplay.
Don't get me wrong, I really dislike spending hours reroling their trades to get what I want, but it was something achievable, but now is completely out of the question to get a full enchanted armor. Mending is pretty much mandatory, otherwise we need to keep making more armors, and on top of that enchant it all over again.
But now it makes so that every base I build needs to be close to the most garbage biome there is. Oh and if I want more variety on my enchantments, guess what? You need to spend hours upon hours finding biomes, finding villages close to them, moving the villagers, breeding them, and bringing them back to your base. And if they die? Too bad, try again.
Alternatively I need to have a trading hall on every biome thousands of blocks away, pretty much making it impossible to have good enchantments before elytra.
If this changes take place I'll be forced to used the enchanting table, which is also pretty hot garbage. And don't even get me started on the anvil situation.
All around, just DONT make it harder and more tedious, make it more interesting, while still early game accessible, take out the incredibly dull rng mechanic, that also includes the biome rng.
If you guys don't want to the villagers be the main source of enchantments, change the enchanting table, and do ir the same way, make it more interesting, take out the rng
And FIX THE ANVILThe wandering trader buff is a very welcome change, far too often does it just feel like an encounter where I get two free leads and nothing else.
The librarian change however doesn't hit the mark. I think giving villagers different trades based on biomes is a really cool premise that can help flesh out the game a lot. But it presents issues with assembling villager trading halls since the work to transport biome villagers would be immense to get them all in one place. I feel as though the best way to implement this would be to leave Plains biome villagers unaffected by inventory changes, that way superflat worlds still have access to the full villager pools.
It would also be nice if there were a way to change villagers biome affiliations when they have no XP, something like the blocks under Job Blocks being able to influence this would be very helpful to avoid building super long rail systems.I personally dont like both of these changes. But if I would have to choose ill get rid of transporting villagers to different biomes for different books its too tedious. Lets say u are early stage of the game so i have to first of all find 7 biomes which is quite a lot specially with jungle being quite rare and then once i discovered the jungle i have TRANSPORT every villager of mine which is a big pain. For example i have jungle 10000 blocks away from my base so i have to go over 1250 blocks by boat in the nether not even trying to go in the normal world instead of nether since its straight up being a masochist and dont die to a ghast or not even me, my villager not dying. Not to mention i have to transport 2 of them so i have to go 4 times same distance. And that was ONE biome so i have to do 6 biomes left so i have to go TWENTY FOUR TIMES do you realise how ridicoulus that is? And lets say tundra is also 10000 blocks away that in numbers is just too much not even saying the mental damage it does transporting villager for an hour in nether and also think how much time would it cost transporting them too.
I'm aware that this is going to be buried, however:
This is a mixed update for me. On one hand, I agree that trading is extremely OP, however, this, combined with the recent netherite change, just makes the game more tedious.
While capping the enchantment levels does make sense, efficiency should be capped at lvl. IV instead of lvl. III, as its max level is V. Please tell me that someone just made a typo in the code.
Also, some of my ideas on how this may be improved:
- Add an option to switch between the two systems when creating a new world, or maybe even as a game rule to change it on the fly.
- Make only the special books exclusive for each biome. Those are fine, I agree with that, however, limiting each book to just one biome means that, even if you don't need the special book of that biome, you're still going to have to travel all the way to that biome (which, if you don't use a seed map like chunkbase, may quite literally take 1-2 hours, even more if you don't have an elytra). This change would also enable us to have the books for the trident, fishing rod and crossbow back in rotation.
- Finally, make villagers easier to transport. I don't know how. Just please, if we have to make them travel hundreds, or thousands or blocks, make it easier to transport them. Maybe have them voluntarily go into a minecart, or add an entirely new minecart type, or make it possible to make trains (Maybe do some developer magic with the furnace minecart?).Thank you for reading.
Just straight up no
1: Please add lava buckets to the wandering trader's trade pool. This helps so many worlds that don't have easy access or no access at all, like skyblock worlds.
2: It would be much better if the max level enchants were restricted to biomes. This way, the people who want to put in the effort can, and the people who don't can put up with using anvils. Additionally, it can be very tedious if you need to max out a villager just to find out you got unbreaking 2.
3: Please make an easier way of creating biome specific villagers if this change is permanent. An example of a way to make this much less tedious could be to make a baby villager to become a Swamp villager if surrounded by enough mud blocks, or a desert villager if surrounded by sand, etc. This would also add a layer of fun complexity to villager breeders.
4: The anvils need a better system or some improvements. One that allows you to use more levels. Experience may be easy to come by for some, but you should just let people use more exp if they really want to repair, rename, or add more enchantments. Make it so you have to get 50 levels or something, people will be more happy they can use the anvil than if it is impossible.The enchantment changes I have a fairly mixed reception about. Too me, they come off as similarly as the combat changes of update 1.9 did for those who are usually entralled with the PvP side of the game. At this point, the current librarian villagers we're familiar with have been around since 1.14, about 4 years and it's something a lot of us have become accustomed too. So any massive changes to it need to be done carefully and regarding enchants, changes need to be done elsewhere for their acquisitions so that players don't solely rely on villagers for enchantments as is apparent with these changes you're considering. If you guys want to push players towards using the other systems, like the enchanting table, then it needs to become even more reliable than it currently is but with a cost to reflect that reliability besides just Lapis and experience points. The smithing table with the armor trims seems like a good place to start with this idea, but gaining knowledge of an enchantment should be based on game-progression like the Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim without having to rely solely on looting structures for that purpose.
This is not a good change. Instead of nerfing villagers you should make the enchanting table and anvil actually usable. I don't know why you think it's acceptable to make the highest level of unbreaking you can get unbreaking 2, but also limit the number of combines you can do in an anvil. You're just making an already tedious system worse, and I can't figure out for the life of my why you devs are so determined to make progression as slow and boring as possible.
This change is a step in the right direction for trading. I'm a pretty avid user of Villagers, and the absolute WORST part is breaking and placing lecterns to get the perfect roll, especially Mending. Guarenteed ways to get Mending that are more difficult to execute sounds like it'd be a lot of fun. However, by gating enchantments this way, a lot of the game suffers.
There is virtually no good alternative to mending. Anvils are ABHORRENT and should be updated alongside this rework in order to alleviate the issues. Combining books and enchantments and gear gets very pricy, and isn't even allowed after a certain threshold. If this is the direction the team decides to go with Villager Trading, the archaic mechanics of the Anvil need to be adapted to accomodate it.
Additionally, this system seems a little too uncommunicated. How is a new player supposed to even know about Swamp and Jungle Villagers without looking online? Something should be done to communicate this fact.
This is a terrible idea, it will make the endgame unplayable for casual players. Having to grind diamonds in a new world to copy the armour trims is already more tedious than it needs to be but having to find and raise villagers in specific biomes is abusive to regular players, not to mention I've had world's where I didn't even find all the biomes until I traveled tens of thousands of blocks away from the spawn point. If you want to improve the game a small improvement that would make a big difference would be to be able to change the world spawn so you could have multiple people on a server who could travel independently and not have to worry about being sent back to 0,0 if they die
I like these changes except for a few:
• Not being able to get max enchantments from Librarians. Not because I'll have to grind more Experience Levels to use them on an anvil, it's because **I won't be able to use them** at all since there's a **39 level limit on anvils**, it'll be incredibly tedious to calculate or look up the order of which enchantment you need to put to your gear/tools, **especially** boots and swords since they have so many enchantments. I like the change, but I'd suggest increasing the anvil's limit as well.
• Some enchantments getting unlocked at the last villager level. If the enchantment has a 100% chance of appearing, then I genuinely like it, but if it's luck based, then it'll just **make players' lives worse**. Just imagine having to spend hundreds, if not thousands, of emeralds to just get a book trade. Though, I'm assuming it's not luck based because of the line:
>*"Players will have to work towards getting the best trades instead of relying on random chance".*
• The biome based trades. Cool idea, giving a reason for different looking villagers and villages, but it will cause **a lot of lag** on multiplayer servers if you setup villages on seven different locations. And if you decide to transport them, too bad, you need to **make an iron farm** to be able to afford making rails to transport them. I'd expand more and give more ideas, but there's a character limit.
In conclusion, these make the game more tedious and grindy, not more fun.
Glancing at the number and doing a little math it looks like about 80% of people don't want this change or flat out think it will ruin the game, only about 20% like it claiming villagers are too OP. The 80% are having this forced on us, especially if we ever want updated worlds or when it comes to Bedrock since you are forced to update whereas the 20% could simply not use villagers if they think they are too OP. Unfortunately this is a shining example of the loud yelling minority ruining everything for the majority. If this change is implemented a lot of people will stop playing Minecraft all together.
Please just don't do that
Registered User commentedComment actions Permalink- Edited
- Report a Concern
- Comment actions Permalink
Mojang, this is your chance to listen to the people. Look at these comments. Take note of what your community is telling you. You have an opportunity right now. Dont blow this. I, like most players, play recreationally a few hours here or there, maybe a bit on the weekend. In order for me to get all the enchants, I'll have to take a week off work to find the time. The only people that will have time to use this new system is professional yourubers who do it for a living. An absolutely massive time suck which will turn people away from the game. If you implement this, you will destroy the game for a huge part of the community, and you will not only lose the trust of your people, but be spending the next 5 years in damage control both with sales and with building your reputation back as a team that values its player base. If you want to prove that you value your player base, now is the time.
I like the idea of making villager books less random, since right now it takes no skill and all luck to get good villager trades. However, if specific books are going to be locked to certain biomes then there needs to be a reliable way of finding these biomes and an easier way of transporting villagers. I could imagine someone wanting to build a base somewhere there isn’t easy access to other biomes. Also the enchanting table should be buffed, it also feels very random and is awful for tools, weapons, and armour with many enchantments (Swords, Helmets, etc.). The main reason librarians took over as the way to get enchantments was because you only had to get lucky once and you could reap the benefits an unlimited amount of times, but with the enchanting table if you lose your equipment or need the same enchantment multiple times you need to get lucky every time. Some way to manipulate the odds of the enchantment table or some way to duplicate enchantments using the enchantment table would be necessary to make it as viable as villager trading.
Registered User commentedComment actions Permalink- Edited
- Report a Concern
- Comment actions Permalink
I think that the idea you proposed with the rebalancing of the auction of enchanted books(next - E.B.) at the librarians is a senseless complication.
1)Most players need only one E.B. and it's a "mending". The complication of trade will make it less expedient to get other E.B. from the librarian. A beginner will not go through thousands of blocks in search of the right biome for the sake of 1 non-maximum level(next - lvl) E.B.
2) The level of enchantments is too low, which will lead to a strong increase in the cost of applying them to an object in the anvil and increase the risk of getting "too expensive". For example, "sharpness" 3 out of 5 at the librarian's Master lvl is too little and unprofitable, because it will take 4 E.B. just to get 5 lvl of "sharpness" . This is not to mention that the total number of experience lvl for casting spells in the anvil will significantly increase.
3)Any experience farm of already developed players negates the bidding with librarians except for those E.B. that cannot be obtained in the Enchanting table(next - E.T.). Building the most primitive experience farm is very easy even for a beginner. E.T. hasn't lost its value. With it, it's much easier and cheaper to enchant boots and helmet and only then add the remaining ones through the anvil.
I think I have given quite strong arguments against this idea.
Registered User commentedComment actions Permalink- Edited
- Report a Concern
- Comment actions Permalink
This would be a terrible change.
1. Superflat players will not be able to access these enchantments
2. Some worlds do not have all biomes near spawn, which makes it difficult for players who do not have as much time on their hands to gets some enchantments.
3. As someone who makes villager trading halls often, this would take away one of the main things that I enjoy doing in game
It's a huge hassle getting biome specific villager trades, so can they at the very least sell max level enchants in their max level? If not, then can you remove the "too expensive" mechanic in the anvil. Since some trades won't be max level, we'd have to combine more books using the anvil. Or at the very least buff the enchantment table. Rather than a straight out nerf, I hope there would still be viable options for players to enchant their gears because this nerf is a huge hassle rather than an interesting game mechanic. Not only would it be confusing to newer players of the game, people who are used to this will only be hassled moving and breeding villagers to different locations to get subpar enchants.
I'm in favour of this change, but it does need tweaking.
The quickest tweak would be to Wandering Traders:
Wandering Traders buying things from the player is long overdue and a VERY welcome change. However, it would be nicer if the player could sell more items and blocks to the Wandering Traders. I mean two things by this.
- Wandering Traders should buy more of the blocks and items that really clog up players' storage systems: cobblestone, granite, andesite, diorite, copper, seeds, poisonous potatoes, etc.
- Wander Traders should purchase more than just one of each item. Obviously not infinite. Hell, I'm not even arguing it needs to be 12. 4-6 is good enough and would result in a lot more Wandering Traders surviving Player encounters.
2554 Comments