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Mob spawning needs to be more balanced on Minecraft

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  • Official comment
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    Jay Wells commented
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    We have a partial fix for this going out in the 1.13.0.15 Beta:

    Tweaked Drowned despawning rules, to help prevent too many being present in the world

    • Drowned will now despawn if the following conditions are met: the player is at least 54 blocks away, the Drowned has not performed any actions in at least 30 seconds, and it is day time

    1.13.0.15 Beta changelog

  • 295
    Aspergerian commented
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    Maybe this'll contribute as an option.

    A slider with three options.

    It can help maintain the framerate for weaker devices, and provide a challenge for stronger devices.

    Both for singleplayer and multiplayer.

  • 47
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    @aspergerian doesn't difficulty already do that?

  • 142
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    The problem is that all this is saying is, "make spawning like the Java edition." The community is upset about spawning on bedrock because it is different from Java, not well explained, and in general not functioning well.
    No one has even explained why it is different from Java. Vague statements about performance do not count. To improve spawning, start with something that works (Java) and then explain what needs improvement. Work on changing things from there instead of making something completely new that is unproven.
    This is the community's biggest issue. Spawning seems to have been changed without warning and without a clear goal. Most people would be ok with bedrock spawning being different from Java, but Java has had years of tweaking and improvements. That seems like a better place to start from rather than a completely new method.

  • 21
    Kevin ChiX commented
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    The only problem I have is the drowned spawning too frequently but yeah they need to balance the mob spawning

  • 44
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    • Slimes should spawn frequently in swamps and slime chunks.
  • 10
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    @Aspergerian yeah that should be done. It be cool ✅

  • 22
    PCScreen commented
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    Whatever is decided later please don't make it exactly like java. I feel like there's no challenge to finding food and mob farms are way too OP. Something in between the current system and java's system would be the ideal solution

  • 38
    Parzival5441 commented
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    Why not add sheep when creating a new world? I created over 50 plus worlds in survival, it takes me approximately 30 minutes to find only one.

  • 14
    KopperXP commented
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    A function to change the amount of mobs would be intriguing. BUT it would not help much if we still do not understand how all generational mechanics works. It could be something that is mirrored in Java, but with a configurable limit amount...

  • 39
    PublicSafety commented
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    The major problem in Bedrock, is mobs don't despawn. So when they hit the mob cap in caves and other generated structures, people thing mob spawning is broken. whereas it is mobs despawning that is the problem.

  • 14
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    Yes, add a slider in world options, that has three levels such as, low, medium, high mob spawning. As of 1.5.2, it is near impossible to make mob farms, which makes it difficult to progress in a survival world. The mob cap rules should be changed as well, Minecraft Bedrock should have an over world mob cap, and a hostile mob mob count.

  • 14
    KYLE GOEMPEL commented
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    They should also add that cap where if there are more than a certain amount of entities in a space then the extra entities start taking damage and dying. This would help with a lot of mob farms.

    Also it is worth mentioning that hostile mobs should not spawn in well-lit areas. 

  • 10
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    All that was left was to have the squids spawn in rivers, like the minecraft java edition.

  • 12
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    I'm not sure why they changed the despawning mechanics from Java, where any hostile mob WILL despawn under the right conditions unless they have been named or are holding a picked up item.  It seems to work well, and would help with mobs taking up the mob cap and preventing others from spawning.

  • 11
    PlusZeadAlh commented
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    There's 3 Options Of Mob Spawning Frequency
    Options 1 Low
    Options 2 Normal
    Option 3 High
    Now choose 3 Options Of Mob Spawning Frequency

  • 9
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    I love that he thought about the appearance of a creature in the game because it is very annoying to start the game having to look for food and only find a damn cow

  • 12
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    So, basically copy paste the java mechanics, i like it! However, with the current default simulation distance on bedrock, it would be kinda hard to implement.

    The current standard is 4 chunks around the player (64 blocks), and to make the java like mechanics and spawning work properly, we would need a standard of 8 chunks (128 blocks). Not a problem on pc, xbox or switch!

    Some modifications would need to be made for mobile devices, as some will only be able to handle 4 chunk simulation, but that shouldn't be too hard to work out! :D

    Also, please note, simulation distance and render distance are completely different. render just allows you to see further, while simulation is where the game is actually doing things in those chunks!

  • 15
    BlackDragonID commented
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    Mob spawns should skew between biomes. These should be logical as possible to make them as intuitive as possible. Additionally, adding a few variants of certain mobs would really help thematically matching mobs to their biomes regardless of functionality.

    For example, in deserts, we could have a "Skeletal Zombies" spawn on the surface since it's all eroded away, but then underground we would find mummies (Hey, maybe they're zombies that drop paper xD) since Egyptians are commonly known for their body preservation. 

    I think one of the coolest examples of mob spawning has got to be Slimes. They're influenced by the phases of the moon! I really think that influencing mob spawns by using a healthy balance of both static (Biome/Temperature) and fluctuating (Weather/Moon Cycle) data would create a more engaging experience where exploration is rewarded with diversity, and game knowledge is rewarded with consistency. 

    I beleive those two factors are going to be key in finding success. Give those who explore interesting and diverse content, and those who want to get technical the consistency that they require to operate miraculous contraptions.

    PS: I like the idea of tracking player-interaction as a metric since it will provide a grace period in which players to rely on a mob not despawning for a purpose. However, I think there may be a fine line as it could cause a player to become frustrated at an abnormally incessant enemy. So exercise caution

  • 8
    BlackDragonID commented
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    Also, add entity cramming.

    I know it's sort of a cheap thing people have been abusing to kill enemies very rapidly, but it exists to prevent my save-file from accidentally becoming unplayable.

    Just reduce its' damage significantly to discourage it as a primary kill method. It's only popular because it's so gosh darn fast.

  • 10
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    The best part of Minecraft at the start was discovering things and experiencing things that only you experienced (or so you thought).

    It'd be amazing to feel this again, perhaps having 4-5 new mystery mobs, which are not heavily detailed or explained on the website, and it is up to the players to work it out in game. 

    Another twist could be that in each single player world you would only get one of type of mystery mobs spawning in that world.

  • 6
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    I like the idea as a slider. I personally want the drowned spawning to stay, as lowering it would nerf trident and nautilus shell farms.

  • 5
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    As stated before, and improve from there...

  • 16
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    Dolphins should require at least a 2x2x2 of water to spawn.  The dolphin in this screenshot spawned in nothing but singular lines of waterlogged fence gates and the one deep flowing water from those sources.  That kind of situation is going to happen only in a farm, and that is not where dolphins should be spawning.

  • 14
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    we need slimes to spawn more frequently in chunks and swamps i was waiting for an hour and nothing spawned and it was a slime chunk at least 1 per 5 minutes and in swamps they should just spawn like regular mobs to make the game balanced and easier and less time consuming

  • 6
    PigCreeperXD commented
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    Nice idea! They also need to make some mob farm possible like guardian, overworld mob, enderman farm etc. The most thing that upset me is guardian doesn't spawn like in java. I literally spend hours cleaning ocean monument. Make them spawn in bubble column too.

    The lower Y axis in the end spawn more enderman.

    (Not related) Able to place block on bedrock ceiling in nether so we can make gold farm.

    Make the hostile and passive mob (naturally spawned, not breeded, nametag etc) despawn like 3 in game day because i noticed alot of animals outside my unloaded chunk.

  • 19
    StarrshipCS commented
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    First off, a question: is this forum actually monitored by Bedrock staff or are we screaming into a void here?

    Second, I think Bedrock spawning is so broken that the devs should START by getting it figured out to mirror the Java version as closely as possible, and THEN we should be having conversations on how to tweak the logic.  As of now spawning is so broken that they don't even know how to fix it to make it like other existing version of the game and entertaining new ideas will only prolong that fix.

    To be clear, very much all about many of these ideas, I just want to see the priority issues handled first before they dive into wish lists. 

  • 8
    Auldrick commented
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    I don't think "make it work like Java" is feasible, either as a goal or as a base from which to restart tuning. Java spawn mechanics are intimately dependent on its chunk management, which is very different from Bedrock's because Bedrock is designed to run on less powerful devices. I think we need to evolve and improve the mechanics we have now.

    I also don't think a global slider can fix the problem, unless you're willing to adjust its setting every time you switch between locales. The developers have already been tweaking the global spawn rates trying to fix this, and it hasn't worked very well. What's too many mobs for one person is too few for another person, and both have legitimate complaints. The underlying problem is that you need the right kinds of mobs in the right numbers AT THE RIGHT PLACES, and the current mechanics can't adjust to different places because, well, what makes one place different from another is mostly determined by how the player intends to use it.

    I believe the solution that would work for everybody is to give the player a measure of control over local spawn rates. One way to do this is with a set of new status effects mediated by a new block. There would be status effects to increase passive mobs, decrease passive mobs, increase hostile mobs, and decrease hostile mobs. The player would control where the block is placed and which effect it exhibits, while the strength of the effect would depend on the size and composition of a surrounding structure. If this sounds like a beacon or conduit, you understand exactly.

    Mojang would still have the ability to tune this mechanism through availability of the block, the size of the effect area, and the required size and composition of the structure. The player would then have the ability to customize mob spawning to fit his particular world and his intentions in different locations, though doing so will have a cost in terms of resources and experience.

    I realize that, because this approach involves design changes to the game, it goes well beyond the kind of tweaking the Bedrock team hopes can solve the problem, but I honestly believe they never will solve it without giving the player some degree of control. If design changes are off the table, maybe the team can think of another way to implement player-influenced local spawn rate controls.

  • 7
    Magefulrage commented
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    I agree with this post, there is an issue with this. I've been caving for hours without seeing mobs before, even in places that aren't lit well. But I do hope that the team is careful about how effective farms become. Sure, I want to be able to build a mob farm and have it work, but if it's too effective it really breaks the game. If it's not effective enough, then it makes the game so "grindy" that it becomes far less of a casual, fun game to play. I agree with others that people have varying preferences on this point. It may be good to have some settings that can be adjusted for this.

  • 6
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    You guys need to fix this fast. Like within a month. Bedrock edition is basically broken for about all kinds of farming. Only mob spawners spawn reasonable rates, but for instant slime.. you might as well take it out of the game all together this way.

     

    I mapped out my world with mcpe_viz, and found 15 slimes in an area of 4000x4000 blocks. That is rediculous. To get a single slime block, one would need to travel like 80k blocks in total, to get enough slime. And one would have to know exactly where the slimes are at, othetwise it would be more efficient to find needles in haystacks.

     

    About Mojangs remarks about the why. I feel this is a bit of crap, as current day 'low end devices' often have faster CPU's and more resources, than the devices had when Minecraft first came out. And that was the Java edition, and Java performs like a wet towel. So I feel performance is a lame excuse.

    However, if performance is the main reason, 2 remarks:

    1) make mobs despawn. Biggest issue with the mob cap is not as much the mobcap, but the not despawning of mobs. I found a cave below my base containing 5 mobs which had accumulated there, and since they don't despawn, this means you're not really getting any spawns anywhere else.

    2) IF performance is the real reason (I don't believe that, but say it is), then make the mob cap dependant on the slowest device in the game. So when starting the game, check which devices are used/connected, and then adjust the cap based upon the slowest device.

    Also there need to be more categories. Give each mob it's own caps. Slimes are a nice example, what good is having slime chuncks, if the mobs spawned around it are filling the cap easily.

     

    Then, another suggestion; instead of first selecting which mob to spawn, first make a selection of possible mobs that COULD spawn there, and THEN decide which one to spawn. So, again, slimes as example, they can spawn in light.

     

    However, first thing the game does, is select a mob to spawn. Then it checks the light. As you have a certain chance of a slime being selected as mob to spawn, this basically means that if you have a well lit area for slimes to spawn, you'll only get a fraction of the slimes spawning, as most of the spawns will be 'lost' on mobs that can't spawn in light.

     

    So suppose I made a flat world, all lighted up, infinitelly big. The mob cap is like 8. Then it would take a lot of time before I actually get 8 mobs, as most 'spawn moments' are wasted on mobs which can't spawn in light.

     

    Make it a setting with a slider, or settable in options.txt.

     

    However, whatever you do, do it FAST. Don't let this issue linger, as it basically breaks the game at the moment.